Wismec Reuleaux DNA200 onboard USB charging safe? Still should Rotate batteries?

[vapesmooth234]

blah..
I'm having trouble deciding between Reuleaux RX200S with an external charger or a DNA200 and using only the onboard USB charging. I would like to omit an external charger which I'm %100 convinced on getting if I do get an RX. I've read too many warnings about RX USB charging. RX often either doesn't charge or possibly drain them balanced An email in a reddit or fasttech thread has the person from Reuleaux stating both RX and DNA do balance charging but I don't really believe it for the RX. I have read that if the three 18650s are too out of balance then the RX won't fire for safety, but have read at least a few times that users had fried their RX completely due to imbalance.

I read it's safe to USB charge the DNA200. I know it will take longer than a fast external charger but I would charge overnight (next to my bed so worst case scenario is it does start a fire and would wake me right up and then I'd break through the wall into the bathroom and put it out with the shower hose).

1) Should I rotate the Reuleaux DNA200 batteries for added safety if I USB charge them, and if so how often? I read some things suggesting this.  This can be a hassle because I know about the protruding rings on the DNA's battery terminals that are there to prevent people from putting batteries upside down but they're known to rip and tare at the batteries. The RX doesn't have this, the protection is built into the chip. I know a lot of people file the protrusions down but I don't want to mess with that nor open it up to fix the fire button hitting the screens ribbon wires because I think soon enough they'll make a better DNA/RX200 and I'll end up selling this one and don't want to sell it all altered looking.


2) I don't want to at all mess with escribe. I have read that if doing USB charging, I need to set battery type profiles in escribe to charge it correctly? 

There is no problem the 5 V from the USB is just converted to a higher voltage and a dedicated chip (I believe) controls the battery charging, monitoring and maintenance, but battery type needs to be set to the correctly type and IIRC the capacity in the EScribe software.  I will not try and get any more technical than this as Evolv can provide the details, but I do think these devices will be less confusing to customers that the one you mention, after all most of the world are used to charging their phones like this.          

https://forum.evolvapor.com/topic/68479-topic/



3) The most I want to do with software is update the firmware. If I update DNA200 to the latest version, will it give me TC stainless steel mode without having to jump through hoops in escribe? It used to be only done though escribe, possibly still is.

4) If the USB is all safe, can I actually passthrough and vape it while it's charging?

5) EDIT: I am much more leaning towards the DNA after writing all the above because I didn't know that Aug 8th on Monday is like the deadline and I might not really be able to get an updated Reuleaux DNA200 that can change out the battery cover to use it as 2 or 3 batteries like the new Reuleaux RX2/3. So I don't want to be stuck with some crap RX chip and migh tjust have to learn escribe if needed for any of the above.  
I'm also considering the HCigar VT133 since it's a DNA and holds just two batteries in case the Reuleaux DNA200 is too big the pocket at certain times.

Thanks

[vapesmooth234]

edit
please would like to know all this before Saturday since Monday is deadline possibly and since I'm going on vacation soon and want my order delivered before then.

Thanks

EDIt: this is interesting.
https://www.reddit.com/r/electronic_cigarette/comments/4cflw4/reuleaux_rx200_internal_charging_testing_analysis/

Allegedly, the RX USB is "safe" but doesn't at all balance charge or discharge but what it does is while charging, it takes whichever battery reaches the max volts and then cuts them all off (and can cause a large discrepancy like .1V). It doesn't actually charge each cell separately (I think that's what the link says), but it treats them all as one - In other words, when one maxes out, they all stop charging. Same goes for discharging which is not balanced but is allegedly safe. The link says if one reaches max minimum volts, they all cut off. They say this all boils down to it still being safe but you will not get good battery life (between chargings for each day, not that the batteries shouldn't still last about 9 months or so).


The only thing stopping me from ordering a DNA200 Reuleaux right this second is if I need to escribe dive to adjust settings for which type of batteries I use if I USB charge it which I do plan to do %100 of the time (I'm okay with tweaking that in escribe later if it will still work out-of-the-box but just that tweaking escribe will give better results, but not at the moment, I'm just too busy to learn escribe).

And would also buy right this second if not for question 1) above, about possibly needing to still rotate batteries OFTEN, like once a charge or two. Once a week or so or if I forget here and there is preferred. I just don't want to wear out the battery wraps on the protruding safety rings. You have to be careful and lift into the spring loaded section is what I read but sometimes the batteries are hard to get a drip on to do that.  

[vapesmooth234]

well, I just bought Wismec Reuleaux DNA200. I read enough to steer me away from anything RX.


I just bought a TFV8 tank that has prebuilt .15 coils that I want to use at full potential. Please link me which batteries I can safely use with .15 or write out the full name of them so I don't get confused with all the choices.

I would also like a recommendation for a second set of batteries that I can get longer life out of but not using such low .15 ohm coils. I don't know exactly how much higher ohms these coils would be since I've never sub ohm vaped but I just bought some RDAs and RTAs and want to do things like dual Clapton builds or stainless steel etc etc. I just know I want dense clouds but with decent battery life for the second set and let me know how low I can build with those batteries. 
Thanks

p.s. would still love if someone can accurately answer the questions in my first post. thanks again.

[VapingBad]

All that "needs" setting in EScribe is battery type = LiPo and 3 cell, the other stuff just makes your battery gauge more accurate, but doesn't affect your vape or battery safety and those will be correctly set when you get it.

[vapesmooth234]

thanks yeah, there's also presets I read for brand and brand and types in escribe. I have those popular LG HG2 browns and there's probably a setting to just set it to that for most efficient use.

I'll see if the newest update gives you SS TC without having to use escribe, I was asking above. That can wait though, I'm doing dual fused claptons for now.  I should get my batteries in tomorrow to finally use the MOD.

For the safety of USB charging I keep asking about, Unless I'm missing something, all this boils down to is if the volts are all Always very similar between the 3 batteries. No more than .3 difference (but I don't think I've read anyone with a DNA getting differences anywhere near that amount -it's very close volt differences with DNA). RX200 Mod is a different story.
In other words, fully charge them USB and use the mod's volt checked PLUS for good measure, I have $400 analog multimeters and cheaper digital ones I can compare to what the DNA chip says (which I read is as accurate as a dedicated multimeter). In other words, if I check them in all different conditions (after full charge, after all batteries are dead and need charging, about an hour of use vaping after full charge, after 3 hours of use etc) then the USB is perfectly safe as long as the volts are always no more than .3 difference. However though, there could be a thing that the DNA chip doesn't cut-off charging them when it should, but I wouldn't' worry about this so much vs using even a dedicated charger. You can change that setting in escribe also to be safer you can cut them off at a lower amount which possibly extends life of them is the whole point in doing that, but what I'm saying is a potential problem would be if the cut-off just doesn't work at all and the batteries over charge, which is something that can happen with all chargers though.  I don't even feel safe with my nitecore D2 which is out of warranty after just one year of not very much use (only used for my dual 18650 headlamp I charge a top of the line pair of $25 batteries in the nitecore. One slot the blinking lights never shows done but the other one does so I have to switch them. It's the slot, not the battery.
Same thing here with a nitecore I just found this in two seconds there's probably tons of similiar instances with all "safe' chargers. so it is what it is.

https://www.reddit.com/r/electronic_cigarette/comments/3s7ba0/overcharged_18650/

[VapingBad]

vapesmooth234 said:

thanks yeah, there's also presets I read for brand and brand and types in escribe. I have those popular LG HG2 browns and there's probably a setting to just set it to that for most efficient use.

I'll see if the newest update gives you SS TC without having to use escribe, I was asking above. That can wait though, I'm doing dual fused claptons for now.  I should get my batteries in tomorrow to finally use the MOD.

For the safety of USB charging I keep asking about, Unless I'm missing something, all this boils down to is if the volts are all Always very similar between the 3 batteries. No more than .3 difference (but I don't think I've read anyone with a DNA getting differences anywhere near that amount -it's very close volt differences with DNA). RX200 Mod is a different story.
In other words, fully charge them USB and use the mod's volt checked PLUS for good measure, I have $400 analog multimeters and cheaper digital ones I can compare to what the DNA chip says (which I read is as accurate as a dedicated multimeter). In other words, if I check them in all different conditions (after full charge, after all batteries are dead and need charging, about an hour of use vaping after full charge, after 3 hours of use etc) then the USB is perfectly safe as long as the volts are always no more than .3 difference. However though, there could be a thing that the DNA chip doesn't cut-off charging them when it should, but I wouldn't' worry about this so much vs using even a dedicated charger. You can change that setting in escribe also to be safer you can cut them off at a lower amount which possibly extends life of them is the whole point in doing that, but what I'm saying is a potential problem would be if the cut-off just doesn't work at all and the batteries over charge, which is something that can happen with all chargers though.  I don't even feel safe with my nitecore D2 which is out of warranty after just one year of not very much use (only used for my dual 18650 headlamp I charge a top of the line pair of $25 batteries in the nitecore. One slot the blinking lights never shows done but the other one does so I have to switch them. It's the slot, not the battery.
Same thing here with a nitecore I just found this in two seconds there's probably tons of similiar instances with all "safe' chargers. so it is what it is.

https://www.reddit.com/r/electronic_cigarette/comments/3s7ba0/overcharged_18650/

If you set your mod for max recharges on the mod tab it will only charge the batteries to 4.1 V, you will have to change options - user interface to advanced to get to the setting in the latest version.  I find the Xtars charger charge to 4.17-4.19 V, I'll send a charger back if I ever see 4.25 V which is overcautions, but I think if it's doing that when it new...

[James]

The results of Battery Analyzer only affect the battery meter. If you can live with a battery meter that is maybe 10% or 15% off, you really don't need to configure anything in EScribe for your batteries.

Weak Battery messages are based on a minimum voltage, and charging goes to a maximum voltage. We did this intentionally so that accidental misconfigurations have cosmetic effects only. The safety-critical systems are not user-configurable.

The battery *type* matters, but Lithium Polymer/18650 is already selected by default. Only if you are using LiFePO4 batteries (I thought people would want to, but it seems not) are you going to need to configure that...

[Doyle4]

Glad I spotted this, I wasnt too sure my self coming from a RX200. Thanks

[vapesmooth234]

I just started using my Reuleaux DNA200 tonight. it took like 20 hours to charge three new LH HG2 3000mAh 20A 18650s in a 2-bay Nitecore i2 alternating them here and there. When charged, a $400 analog multimeter read 4.2 for all, and a $4 harbor freight digi meter read 4.22. How do I use the MOD's built-in volt meter to read the volts of each battery so I can compare the readings to the external multimeters just for peace of mind that the chip is charging and discharging evenly? I see no mention of this in the instructions. I saw an RX200 video, the guy locks it and holds all three buttons but that just makes my DNA ask which material (SS Ti Ni). Does the DNA version even have this volt meter?

I downloaded escribe and it's not as complex as I thought, actually pretty cool, but I have some questions. Sorry for so many questions vs slowly learning and digesting this. I'm going on a trip and don't want to fry this mod because of wrong settings. 
  
First I downloaded escribe here https://www.evolvapor.com/products/dna200 (there's nothing in escribe that like links my computer to the internet or anything, right?)
Then it said there was an auto update so I did that and I didn't download anything here http://www.wismec.com/product/reuleaux-dna200/
you see in the blue text on the right I see people mention that link possibly still needing it even if escribe Auto updated it.

I added SS 316 and Titanium in "Materials", and now the mod shows that option when I hold all three buttons when locked (I was wondering this all along but it was simple after the update, possibly only previously it was trickier to do SS TC). I'm not ready for TC but just was wondering this. 

I changed the screen brightness to %20 when charging so I can keep an eye on it I guess to see the voltage current of the charge if I'm understanding this. Or will the screen on during chargin actually make it take significantly longer to USB charge? I slightly lowered the other brightnesses down from %100. 
Edit: after posting this, I noticed USB'd to my PC, it showed .97 Amp charging rate, same as when plugged into a wall adapter (which I think is capable of up to 2A but I guess the DNA is capped at 1Amp). But then I tried some 99 cent POS cable because it's much longer and I use it with my other MOD as a passthough. There was no reading, it never went into charging mode (lighting bolt icon through the battery bar on the DNA screen). So then I tried yet another USB cable and it now no mater which cable I use, including the one that was included with the MOD, it shows a fluctuating charging amperage of anywhere from around .60-.75. It's at about %60 battery life. Maybe this is normal and it will work its way up to 1.0A charging current?
 
I vape it while it's plugged in USB charging. Even when connected to escribe but I think it's meant to do that (Device Monitor tab) unless vaping while USB'd is a big no no?

 I changed in escribe Behavior of batteries in Mod tab, Charging Mode changed from Maximum puffs to Max Recharges. All I care about is the batteries will last long between charges (I'm okay if I have to buy a new set a month or so earlier vs the other option, but maybe I should switch it back because someone mentioned it's safer to be on Max Recharges because it only charges them to 4.1Volts but maybe I can manually set that and still have it last as long as possible between charges?

What I need help with is setting up using LG HG2 3000 mAh 20A batteries. I have a TFV8 octa coil at .15 ohms kanthal and it says on the coil something like "best vaped at 120 Watts" but I'm fine at like 60 Watts, I don't see myself going over 100 watts. I have a .45 ohm dual Clapton kanthal in a drip tank that I vape at only like 25 watts. I'm new to this tanks and coils though. I'm just saying I don't think I'll be vaping super high wattage if that matters for how I set the batteries. What I'm wondering is it says

Battery capacity 21.44 Wh               3-cell
Cell soft Cutoff 2.8V

24A for max continuous input current
24A max pule input current



Electrical
Mod Resistance .003 ohms
Ohm lock range -/+ %25

I watched a tutorial and he show to do what I'm trying to do, click Watt-Hour Calculator But I don't want to mess up anything. It's saying I'm only using 720 mAh as default. It has 3.7 as Nominal Cell Voltage. Why isn't is 4.2V like what they charged to? I remember 3.7V being like a magic # with ego twist mods and stuff though. I'm just really confused.

It says Nominal Pack Voltage 11.1

"Load SCV" would be if I download someone's file for the 3000 mAh LG HG2 20As? And it would auto set it all optimally for those? I don't want anyone's files though, I'm like paranoid about computer safety, this escribe

 

One other thing I noticed in Profile 1, it says Power 52.2 Watts but all other 7 profiles say 8.5. Maybe I locked in something messing around with holding down buttons on the MOD? I can indeed up the watts to 150 and vape and it's too harsh but just making sure.

[VapingBad]

To see the cell voltages on the device you can choose them as the optional fields on the screen tab in EScribe, I do that for the charging screen on my Rolo.

Change materil is only on the version of EScrib you have and the early one (link in my footer), the early one has new new fw with much better ss temp limiting, different optional fields for temp and no-temp operation and other good things.

Max charging current is 1 A via USB, even with the best cables I typically see 0.99X A, it will lower the current toward the end of the charge cycle.  It is designed to allow you to vape while plugged into USB, it paused if you press the fire button until 5 secs after release.

Max puffs is safe, max recharges is the easiest way to extend the life of you batteries, you could double their life IIRC for only 10% capacity loss, better than swapping them out before they are empty.

The battery type ans number of cells settings are important, the Watt hours only makes the battery metre more accurate so don't sweat about changing that.  The load CSV there loads the voltage vs capacity curve you can see on that page, not any other settings, it is independent of the capacity and poses no risk I can see other that it being wrong and needing to restore the default.

I think you someone have changed the setting to 52.2 W like you say.

[vapesmooth234]

cool thanks for the tip that I can show battery volts as an optional screen. I think the DNA screen just doesn't have enough pixels compared to the larger RX200/ RX200S / RX2/3 to show volts for all three when holding all 3 buttons in lock mode like they do.


"I think you someone have changed the setting to 52.2 W like you say."

should I change that? I don't even know what it means.

Should I change my battery mAhs to 3000? I vape a tfv8 .15 coil at only like 45 watts (it suggest like 120Watts) and a .45 dual coil at like 25 watts, which is low and possibly killing my battery (or maybe I have that concept backwards and I am saving battery doing low watts)?

all I know is I had the mod fully charged and took maybe 40 puffs and the battery icon showed about %60. I have been mostly pssthrough vaping it since though and it's always at 90-100%

I don't' know what to put if I even should change it for Nominal and the stuff I wrote in my last message about
Battery capacity 21.44 Wh               3-cell
Cell soft Cutoff 2.8V

24A for max continuous input current
24A max pule input current

I won't have my log in credentials but will check the thread while on vacation I hope maybe someone can answer though anything unanswered. You can message me your paypal and I'll send you $20 even thanks.   




  

[Spector NS5 RD]

for "battery capacity" type in 33 watt hours if you're using the HG2's. it'll make your battery meter a little more accurate that's all. leave evertyhing else alone.      
formula for converting mah to watt hours -  (mAh)*(V)/1000 = (Wh)  

3000mah * 11.1v / 1000 = 33.3 wh's 

i honestly hope no one in this forum would take $20 from another member for helping them. 

[BillW50]

ChunkyButt200 said:

i honestly hope no one in this forum would take $20 from another member for helping them. 

[vapesmooth234]

Bumping this 1-year old thread with follow-up. To not read the whole thread, all you need to know is I was wondering if charging the DNA200 MOD via usb was safe enough to omit the slight hassle of using an external dedicated charger.

Well, I thought I'd post to this thread again, because since I posted it I used this MOD daily with the same three LG browns HG2 3000 mAh 20A batteries. I never once took the batteries out. I never rotated them or anything. I never charged them in any way besides using the onboard USB (except when I first got the batteries, I charged them in a nitecore i2).  I ran them (the MOD) to zero battery only about 4 times since having them for about a year. I usually ran them to about %35 and then I left the MOD charging overnight pretty much every night since I first posted this. I used it as a passthrough while charging often.

A couple days ago, I finally took the batteries out to check their voltage. I let the USB charge them until it said %100. About 3 hours after taking the charged batteries out of the MOD, I tested them on a cheap digital multimeter. I set it to DVC 20. Two of the three cells read 4.09. The other cell bounced between 4.08 and 4.09 and eventually stayed put at 4.08. The 4.08 was the inner left battery by the way (when opening the back of the case and looking in) - I think that might be the first battery that gets the charge or something like that.

When I set the multimeter to DCV 200, they all read 4.1

On a ~$375 Simpson analog multimeter,
I set one of its dials to +D.C
The other main center dial I set to 10V
All 3 cells read 4.4 on the AC line which maxes out at 10

I don't really know which is the correct dial setting to read these batteries, but most other settings would make the needle jump all the way to max, or it would barely move the needle.

If I set the dial to AC instead of +D.C, and kept the main center dial at 10V, they all read 4.6 on the AC line.

After this, I put them in an Xtar VC2 plus charger. The charger said they were %75 charged (this charger can't read voltage though I don't think). I left them charge for about 45 mins at full 1A charging rate. I didn't test them with the multimeter after charging them in the Xtar.

what does this all mean? The DNA charging port is safe? Why were they only %75 charged according to the Xtar? Thanks.

 

[Wayneo]

On 8/4/2016 at 10:54 PM, vapesmooth234 said:

............ I would charge overnight (next to my bed so worst case scenario is it does start a fire and would wake me right up and then I'd break through the wall into the bathroom and put it out with the shower hose).

If your bedroom wall is still intact .........

3 hours ago, vapesmooth234 said:

The DNA charging port is safe?

I'm voting safe

[67exec]

I would put my money on the dna vs the xstar

[retird]

You might read about "life cycle of batteries" and charging.....  Battery University is a good resource....

http://batteryuniversity.com/

I never charge batteries unattended....nor overnight.....

[BillW50]

Naw... both the XTAR VC2 and VC4 are good dang chargers. I use them all of the time. And so is the DNA200 for charging. The reason why the XTAR probably said only 75% charged is because you probably have EScribe setup for maximum charges, which only charges each cell to 4.10v instead of 4.20v. This makes the battery last twice as long as full charging them.

Yes I know a lot about those Simpson analog meters too, I had used them for decades. I haven't used one in years now. But even though you get a reading on AC, it won't be correct reading. And it should work on DC. So something is wrong there.

[vapesmooth234]

6 hours ago, BillW50 said:

Yes I know a lot about those Simpson analog meters too, I had used them for decades. I haven't used one in years now. But even though you get a reading on AC, it won't be correct reading. And it should work on DC. So something is wrong there.

Well if you look at the picture of the simpson Meter, what I said was AC is the 2, 4, 6, 8, 10, line in black text, now I think is actually DC, not AC. 

http://www.simpson260.com/260-6/simpson_260-6p-1-001.jpg

 

 

I guess the DNA port IS safe especially with these quality LG browns. Because the main factor would be differences (aka discrepancies) between the batteries voltages when using multiple cells in a MOD. If they were reading something like 4.1, 3.8, 4.3, then it could be unsafe. But they are all the same except for that one was bouncing between 4.09 and 4.08 instead of staying put at 4.09 (this was on a Free/cheap Harbor Fright digital Multimeter by the way).

 

 

I think the question that was really bugging me is why did the Xtar (yes it is a good charger based on my research and asking, so is the nitecore, but I did have one port on the nitecore stopped charging to full [I many times charged a head lamp's 18650s in the nitecore, and since it half stopped working, I bought an Xstar VC2 plus for the headlamp to charge $20 quality pair of batteries, these http://www.ebay.com/itm/2x-Keeppower-Protected-18650-3400mAh-with-Panasonic-NCR18650B-Li-ion-Battery-PCB-/122298469527?hash=item1c798e8c97:g:TO0AAOSwA3dYbSTw

2x Keeppower Protected 18650 3400mAh with Panasonic NCR18650B Li-ion Battery PCB

 

Anyway, maybe I DID change the escribe setting to only charge them to 4.1. Good observation. I did reread the this thread and seems I might have opted to purposely not do that, but I will download escribe now and check and report back. If I didn't set ti like that, then I'm confused, but still feel safe because there were no discrepancies.

 

thanks for the replies. I think I linked this thread to two other vaping forums because people were highly doubting the DNA's onboard usb, and this should show it's safe. The cheaper chips/boards though I would NOT charge with the USB, they are known to cause discrepancies, dangerous.  

 

 

 

 

[vapesmooth234]

11 hours ago, BillW50 said:

The reason why the XTAR probably said only 75% charged is because you probably have EScribe setup for maximum charges, which only charges each cell to 4.10v instead of 4.20v. This makes the battery last twice as long as full charging them.

I downloaded escribe again after having not used it for about a year when I set up this MOD. Took a minute to figure out I needed to set escribe to Advanced Mode to see the MOD tab and the battery info.

 

I think you solved it why the Xtar said they were only %75. My settings said I did have CHARGING MODE set to MAXIUM RECHARGES instead of the only other option is MAXIMUM PUFFS. But Xtar said %75 and the only difference is 4.1 (MAX RECHARGES) vs 4.2 (MAX PUFFS). But I would think the Xtar would say something like %97 charged (the % difference between 4.1 and 4.2 is only %2.41).

I also might have set it to be that it says SOFT CELL CUT OFF: 2.8V if that matters.

 

I just googled that sony browns are supposed to read 4.2V fully charged, so why did the simpson analog (~$350) say they're all 4.4 after the Xtar charged them? The Xtar is faulty?  

thanks.

Edited July 30, 2017 by vapesmooth234

[VapingBad]

Sounds like your external charger is faulty, it should charger to 4.2 V, some charge as high as 4.25 V, personally I prefer to avoid these, but over 4.25 V is not good and could cause poor quality batteries to go into thermal runaway.   4.1 would be around 90%.