dwcraig1 Posted February 11, 2017 Report Share Posted February 11, 2017 I guess I might as well through this in.The DNA200 has a hard cell cut off of 2.85 volts unless that changed with firmware update, I don't know but doubt it.Probably the 250 is the same in regards to cut off, again I don't know for sure.The 200/250 was designed to operate with a LiPo pack not round cells (18650, ect.) hence the higher soft/hard cutoff.18650's, ect have their mah capacity measured between 2.5 - 4.2 volts, a lipo shouldn't be drained down that low.So when you use 18650's, ect. with a board designed for a LiPo pack so the capacity of the round cell between 2.5 and 2.85 volts is not usable.I set my round cell powered 200's 12% lower than what the calculator comes up with.A firmware update listing the round cells would be an option but for sure folks would be using it with a Lipo and that could end up being a safety issue. Call every thing here "just my opinion" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asmodeus Posted February 11, 2017 Report Share Posted February 11, 2017 I'm kinda seeing it like this... 1. The minikin v1.5 for $60 can nearly do what a DNA 167 can do. It's less BS, and has a better form factor. It suffers only in that the temp control is jerky, and my 510 loosened and I had to tighten it. 2. Conversely the DNA's temp control is buttery smooth. The initial battery setup and black sheeping of 18650 users leaves a lot to be desired. In fact the discharge profiles, and single meter is inherently poor by today's standards. The screen also leaves a lot on the table information/vs space wise. It's level of configuration that balances it out. But even building it all myself I have north of $130 in it. And these battery profiles and watt hours are inherently flawed in a device with replaceable batteries. Give me an option to set the meter to resting battery voltage and avoid that tangled mess. I have many different kinds of 18650 batteries. Both in age and type. I realize that the 18650 set up is an afterthought, but it exists. The baby is in the crib so to speak. So now that we are here, you gotta deal with it. And the way it is being crippled with 3S LiPo settings sucks. Two %'s would work. Stick the meter(s) to resting cell voltage. Watching it sag wouldn't hurt my feelings. And when I switch from 30Q's to VTC's I wouldn't need a friggin laptop... The DNA on 18650's is a Ferrari with a broken gas gauge. I don't need 250W's. But I would like my battery meter to work with whatever I pop in it... As of this very moment there are multiple threads about people hitting the soft cut limit on battery sag and not knowing what is causing the mod to not fire properly. How low can I go on the soft cut limit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 I guess for me the bottom line to a DNA mod is that it's a luxury item/toy to play with and doesn't have alot to do with keeping me off of tobacco anyway. I have 4 DNA mods but 1 is still new in the box which would be the Triade DNA 250. I still like them and I'll keep messing with them I reckon. But like you say, You can get a satisfying vape from a $40.00 - $60.00 mod just as easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VapingBad Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 You really don't "need" to set up the battery curve or capacity, they don't affect anything other than the battery metre. It is one of those untrue truisms that pervades the vapesphere that these needs to be done, I have been using the default curve in my rolo for well over a year now. Same goes for case analyser and mod resistance they are beneficial, but not essential and in an ideal world they would be set correctly by the manufacture. Though if you are at ultra low res of very high power I do suggest you set your mod res. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asmodeus Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 VapingBad said:You really don't "need" to set up the battery curve or capacity, they don't affect anything other than the battery metre. I don't "NEED" a gas gauge in my car either. I can just do my best to feel when the tank is getting low from the way the car handles a good bend at speed.But I deserve a functional one. One that doesn't care if I fill up at Sunoco, BP, Exxon, or perhaps even spike the tank with toluene. Tying the meter to battery voltage solves the problem in the simplest way possible. Set a simple voltage scale stretching between 4.2v and the discharge limit and let me select that instead. Two little bars a few pixels wide would go a long way to nudge the DNA up to the standard that we should expect from a chip these days. The chip alone costs more than a functional mod with these features. We shouldn't make excuses for mediocracy. In their quest to make an ultra customizable battery meter for LiPo's the simple solution for 18650's was entirely neglected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VapingBad Posted February 12, 2017 Report Share Posted February 12, 2017 Leaving them at the defaults will put it functionality on a par with other boards using swappable batteries, setting will get you a little more accuracy than other mods, not setting will cost you zero compared to other boards it all still works fine. The curve is just to better match different models of battery, none should be far from the default curve and they would vary with the age of the battery and load. Batteries can be tracked more accurately if they are fixed, but with removable batteries the board has no heuristics and has to go by a voltage to percent map, that's just life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spector NS5 RD Posted February 13, 2017 Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 @asmodeous evolv is open to suggestions. post your idea in the feature request thread. i think a voltage based battery meter with sag would be a nice option for the DNA 75 and 60, especially. TBH, i find i never take the cells out of any of my DNA 133/167/200's. if the cells get low, i just plug in the USB to charge and rotate to a different mod. if i'm going out, i make sure the mod's charged or take a mod that i know will last the duration of...whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 Well I guess I at least have my original question answered. I gather there is no setting for the end user to curve or turn off the step down on the DNA's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spector NS5 RD Posted February 13, 2017 Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 Evo1340 said:Well I guess I at least have my original question answered. I gather there is no setting for the end user to curve or turn off the step down on the DNA's. "turn off the step down"? what do you mean. i don't understand your question.you either have poor/rewrapped/fake cells or a connection issue, or both. there is no option in EScribe to let the cells drain dangerously low so you can avoid the "weak battery" or "check battery" messages, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 You would have to read my first post in this thread. The reason I started it was to try and find an answer to my question about whether or not I can adjust a setting in Escribe to control how the step down function works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VapingBad Posted February 13, 2017 Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 I think what you are asking is can you set it to have step-up as well, no the physical circuit is step-down only and that allows it to operate with 97% efficiency. It is a bit like asking if you can change your motorbike to a car by changing a setting, the hardware is too differient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 I'm not sure what wanting less interruption in my vaping has to do with 97% efficiency. If you mean it does well at doing what it was designed to do then I got ya. I'm not sure you know what I mean when I say I want to change the step down settings. I just want it to be less aggressive. If I have my device set at 120W with a .2ohm dual coil setup in my RDA, THAT is where I want it. If my batteries go down to 60% charge remaining and the DNA board changes automatically when I hit the fire button so that I only get say 87W's at maybe 3.78volts damn it that's not what I want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VapingBad Posted February 13, 2017 Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 Evo1340 said:I'm not sure what wanting less interruption in my vaping has to do with 97% efficiency. If you mean it does well at doing what it was designed to do then I got ya. I'm not sure you know what I mean when I say I want to change the step down settings. I just want it to be less aggressive. If I have my device set at 120W with a .2ohm dual coil setup in my RDA, THAT is where I want it. If my batteries go down to 60% charge remaining and the DNA board changes automatically when I hit the fire button so that I only get say 87W's at maybe 3.78volts damn it that's not what I want. If you want to be less aggressive lower the watts, unless you know a way around the first law of thermodynamics or get better batteries that's all that is possible, if I understand your question and I'm not positive I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retird Posted February 13, 2017 Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 I'm thinking the huge battery sag you are seeing won't let you achieve the 120 watts you want all the time...if the battery can't supply the 120 watts desired as the battery charge is reduced then yes you will achieve lower wattage only. Is that what you are getting at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 Yes but at least it improved when I put a new pair of batts in. Part of it is due to the older batts and partly because of the board automatically taking over as it is designed to do with batteries that are not as strong/ holding enough charge. I got a reply from a tech at Evolv finally. It seems there is no way to change the step down on the board which is what I have been asking about all along? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 I'm not sure what you mean The only power limit I find is in this pic. Besides I am running with 2 18650's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2017 Evo1340 said:I'm not sure what you mean The only power limit I find is in this pic. Besides I am running with 2 18650's.Oops, now his post is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spector NS5 RD Posted February 14, 2017 Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 just use common sense, if the cells are too weak to provide the power you're asking for, it's not wise to push them to the point where they become damaged or YOU become damaged. play it safe, use good quality cells that are capable of delivering the power you need. do that, and the DNA will happily pump out the watts you desire, accordingly. don't, and the DNA protects you...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retird Posted February 14, 2017 Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 Also, unless I missed it you never mentioned if you were also getting a "weak battery" message..... From the Datasheet it says:Weak Battery: The battery needs to be charged, or a higher rate battery needs to be used. If this happens, the DNA 250 will continue to fire the atomizer, but will not be able to provide the desired wattage. The Weak Battery message will continue to flash for a few seconds after the end of puff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 retird said:Also, unless I missed it you never mentioned if you were also getting a "weak battery" message..... From the Datasheet it says:Weak Battery: The battery needs to be charged, or a higher rate battery needs to be used. If this happens, the DNA 250 will continue to fire the atomizer, but will not be able to provide the desired wattage. The Weak Battery message will continue to flash for a few seconds after the end of puff.Actually, the strange thing is the only error message I saw was the screen on the mod telling me the atomizer resistance was too high. I think it was "resistance too high". But as I stated before, it is alot better with the new batts. Just still get the step down with the battery drain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spector NS5 RD Posted February 14, 2017 Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 "Ohms too high" means you're exceeding the maximum voltage output the board can provide. this means, the wattage will automatically be adjusted down to level it can output. it goes as follows....6.2 volts MAX for the DNA 75 6 volts MAX for the DNA 133 / DNA 167. 9 volts MAX for the DNA 200. 9.3 volts MAX for the DNA 250my suggestion to you is, build a lower ohm coil. this will help you avoid the "ohms too high" message. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 Well that is with .2ohm coils. I do still get the step down in wattage and voltage without any error message while firing when the new batteries are draining. You guys know more about this stuff than I would so I don't try to come across as though I understand it all. I just feel like it doesn't give me what I thought it would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwcraig1 Posted February 14, 2017 Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 0.3 ohms (hot if TC wire) @ 6 volts =120 watts0.2 ohms at 6 volts would be 180 wattsHere I'm seeing around 3.65 voltshttps://forum.evolvapor.com/topic/65896-topic/?do=findComment&comment=892026 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evo1340 Posted February 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 dwcraig1 said:0.3 ohms (hot if TC wire) @ 6 volts =120 watts0.2 ohms at 6 volts would be 180 wattsHere I'm seeing around 3.65 voltshttps://forum.evolvapor.com/topic/65896-topic/?do=findComment&comment=892026What I'm using they call Hive wire with Kanthal. With the new batts I turned it down to 105W with .2ohm dual coils but unless the batts are fully charged..... Anyway, I get the point. No more reason to talk about it. I understand the board in the DNA250 is made to protect itself and batteries which protects the user so.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spector NS5 RD Posted February 14, 2017 Report Share Posted February 14, 2017 there should be some message that flashes across the screen, unless you have your error flashes set 0 or 1 times. my guess is your hitting your "cell soft cutoff" limit. if you know you are using the correct cells (cells that have an amp rating capable of providing the power you're asking from them) and still getting a reduction in power, i would email Boxer and describe your problem. you have some bad wire soldering. Boxer would be the people who would fix that for you. it should still be under warranty, right?im curious, what kind of cells are you using? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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