Discharge profiles for WisMec ReuLeaux

[bo0st]

Anyone have a battery profile for green 25r's?

[Jaquith]

I don't mind doing a Profile for Samsung 25R's but they're not brand new batteries nor are they married from day one. I was going to do a Sony VTC5 Profile because mine are relatively 'new.' So let me know. The 25R's are probably 4-5 months old, but they appear to be working fine. It is easy to do as a DIY, just make a rabbit ears Atty as is shown here and run the Battery Analyzer http://i.imgur.com/gEGDWV1h.jpg

[Darthtanien]

Jaquith said:

I don't mind doing a Profile for Samsung 25R's but they're not brand new batteries nor are they married from day one. I was going to do a Sony VTC5 Profile because mine are relatively 'new.' So let me know. The 25R's are probably 4-5 months old, but they appear to be working fine. It is easy to do as a DIY, just make a rabbit ears Atty as is shown here and run the Battery Analyzer http://i.imgur.com/gEGDWV1h.jpg

Hello Jaquith. Could you please do the Sony VTC5 profile. I would like to see what you get. I like your input and how you do your profiles. Thank you.

[dedone]

Darthtanien said:

[QUOTE=Jaquith]I don't mind doing a Profile for Samsung 25R's but they're not brand new batteries nor are they married from day one. I was going to do a Sony VTC5 Profile because mine are relatively 'new.' So let me know. The 25R's are probably 4-5 months old, but they appear to be working fine. It is easy to do as a DIY, just make a rabbit ears Atty as is shown here and run the Battery Analyzer http://i.imgur.com/gEGDWV1h.jpg

Hello Jaquith. Could you please do the Sony VTC5 profile. I would like to see what you get. I like your input and how you do your profiles. Thank you.[/QUOTE]

Me too please!!!!!

[MegaVape]

Thanks @Jaquith I am getting all your info into a folder so when I get my Wismec Tuesday I will be ready to rock-n-roll! Kudos!!

[Jaquith]

Sorry it took so long, we're moving. Linked below are the Sony VTC5 Battery Profiles for both the 2S 133W and 3S 200W. The noticeable differences are the Sony VTC5 loses about 4 Wh over the LG HG2's and cutoff at 3.1xV whereas the LG HG2 cutoff is around 3.0xV. My Sony VTC5's are not brand new but they're about 2-3 months old and of the VTC5 're-release type' but are indeed authentic. I entered the standard Sony VTC5 settings (Nominal 3.6V*3=10.8V, Capacity 2600 mAh, Cutoff 2.5V) and ran the tests. Per spec the 'Rated' @ 10A is 8.8 Wh*3= 26.4 vs 'Observed' 24.8 Wh or a difference of 1.6 Wh which is actually very good since the DNA 200 doesn't drain to rated cutoff voltage.

Profiles http://www.filedropper.com/sonyvtc5profilesdna200

Here's an overlay comparing the 2 batteries:

 

Side-by-Side Wh, Cutoff, Profile:

[Jaquith]

bo0st said:

Anyone have a battery profile for green 25r's?

Well I ran a Profile for the (aka my old) Samsung 25R's and the following Battery Profile is from a set + 1, same batch, batteries; the set have been paired for several; months in a Sigeli 150W Mod and the +1 from an old IPV 4 Mod. Ideally I'd much, much, prefer to use a brand new set of 25R's or any batteries. When I came home the test had completed, but I noted 3.30V, 3.35V, and a 3.41V .. that's not a 'good' example however the 3.07V test cutoff is good.

Under a 'Rated' 10A load 8.74 Wh*3 = 26.22 Wh vs 'Observed' 22.86 Wh or 3.36 Wh which is good but a new set probably would have been a tad better.

Battery Profile Samsung 25R http://www.filedropper.com/samsung25rprofile

Here's an overlay comparing the 3 batteries (pretty close over all):

 
Side-by-Side Wh, Cutoff, Profile:

 

[Darthtanien]

Thank you Jaquith. Going to see how this works compared to mine.

[Darthtanien]

JAquith. What version of Escribe are you using? I have mine updated but it does not look like yours.

[Jaquith]

Darthtanien said:

JAquith. What version of Escribe are you using? I have mine updated but it does not look like yours.

2015-10-21 EScribe 1.0.35.2 .. just checked I'm up to date, unless there's an Alpha?!

[Darthtanien]

Jaquith said:

[QUOTE=Darthtanien]JAquith. What version of Escribe are you using? I have mine updated but it does not look like yours.

2015-10-21 EScribe 1.0.35.2 .. just checked I'm up to date, unless there's an Alpha?![/QUOTE]

Mine says 1.0.32   I just downloaded yesterday and I thought this updated automatic ? Where did you get your version ? Your battery tab has a manufacturer back button and a few other different things than mine does.

[Jaquith]

Darthtanien said:

Mine says 1.0.32   I just downloaded yesterday and I thought this updated automatic ? Where did you get your version ? Your battery tab has a manufacturer back button and a few other different things than mine does.

Technically it's a Beta but everyone's using it; bookmark this page https://forum.evolvapor.com/topic/66731-topic/

[Darthtanien]

Jaquith said:

[QUOTE=Darthtanien]Mine says 1.0.32   I just downloaded yesterday and I thought this updated automatic ? Where did you get your version ? Your battery tab has a manufacturer back button and a few other different things than mine does.

Technically it's a Beta but everyone's using it; bookmark this page https://forum.evolvapor.com/topic/66731-topic/[/QUOTE]


Thanks again. Downloading it now.

[freedogg]

Jaquith....you don't happen to have data for LG HE4's do ya??   Thanx!!

[Jaquith]

RE HE4's .. no I'm sorry I don't but they're damn near close to 25R's as in they're practically the same performance; statistically negligible 5A, 10, and 20A discharges. See for yourself, the initial voltage drop is about the only difference, and then they follow nearly identical discharge curve http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650comparator.php

[Joei]

Jaquith said:

Sorry it took so long, we're moving. Linked below are the Sony VTC5 Battery Profiles for both the 2S 133W and 3S 200W. The noticeable differences are the Sony VTC5 loses about 4 Wh over the LG HG2's and cutoff at 3.1xV whereas the LG HG2 cutoff is around 3.0xV. My Sony VTC5's are not brand new but they're about 2-3 months old and of the VTC5 're-release type' but are indeed authentic. I entered the standard Sony VTC5 settings (Nominal 3.6V*3=10.8V, Capacity 2600 mAh, Cutoff 2.5V) and ran the tests. Per spec the 'Rated' @ 10A is 8.8 Wh*3= 26.4 vs 'Observed' 24.8 Wh or a difference of 1.6 Wh which is actually very good since the DNA 200 doesn't drain to rated cutoff voltage.

Profiles http://www.filedropper.com/sonyvtc5profilesdna200

Here's an overlay comparing the 2 batteries:

 

Side-by-Side Wh, Cutoff, Profile:

Thank you, thank you! I was looking for a solution with the VTC5's, my mod was going from approx 70% to 40% with original profile loaded on the HE4'S. I loaded your profile and have been using the mod all day with an hour charge in between for the analyzer and I am currently at 61% from 8am to currently 10am est. Very impressed, thanks again! Joe

[Spector NS5 RD]

Ran battery analyzer on my wismec for a set of new, LG HG2's 

Actual Watt Hours = 28.39 (2.8v cutoff, 80 watts, .29 ohm load)
Tried uploading the battery curve but it wont let me upload a csv type file and im too stupid to figure out a way around it.

thanks @bmclaurin


 LG HG2 28.39 WH.csv.txt




    

[bmclaurin]

You can just add a .txt extension to the filename.

[rask116@hotmail.com<rask1]

Seven pages of diatribe and I've not seen one really definitive answer to things.  We only have 4 settings to deal with in escribe. One being

"TYPE"= either Lithium Polymer, LiFePO4, power supply.

Yet I've read some saying set it to Lithium Polymer and some saying LiFePO4. of course with countless words arguing about it.

 So which is it for 3x 18650?

Second setting is capacity,

well 3 x 4.2 volts is 12.6v and 3 x 3.2v is 9.6.  (generally what many call a safe stopping point on 18650s) Default of escribe is 11.1v

So what is a good starting point to set this capacity to for those who

1. Have just gotten their WisMec ReuLeaux and haven't yet gotten to run the battery analyzer or

2. Simply don't have a computer or for whatever other reason (including pure laziness) can't run it.

And then there is  cell soft cutoff. Again up and down mixed messages on this too.  So what is it for a good starting point?

I ask because I just got mine this evening. I  spent all the time reading this thread and I'm sitting here scratching my head about a whole lot of things. I even went to the WisMec site and downloaded their suggested files which set  my capacity to 21. 44wh, which to me makes no sense at all, since I'm running 3x 2600mAh Sony vtc 5s.  If I do the math for 11.1v for 2600mAh,  it equates to 28.96wh Even if I just use 90% of this, we are talking 26.07wh with a 11.1v setting. BTW 3.7v x 3 is the 11.1v default. Not a bad setting if you ask me, since most good 18650s will charge all the way up to 4.2 volts and it takes awhile for them to get down to 3.7 volts in most mods running between 35w and 50w.

HOWEVER and looking at the vtc5 chart  Jaquith provided and shared again on this page by Joei . I have to assume, going by the vtc5 chart, that the wh shown on the chart of 24.81 wh is  done at 9.6 volts, since the math for 9.6 volts on 2600mAh batteries equates to 24.96wh. 9.6 divided by 3 cells is 3.2v a cell.

Then we have that final choice. CHARGING MODE = Maximum Puffs or Maximum Recharges. (have no idea what either means really.

Now as soon as I get those vtc5 charged, I am defiantly going to do the battery analyzer. I'll be using the loop coil method with 20 ga 317L ss and an ohm rating of .21. Probably do it at 50w. But until then,  I think we need a definitive starting point listed for everyone.

As in: Set your type as __________Lithium Polymer

Set your Capacity at this ________ use the EScribe software with your batteries mAh and 9.6v

Set soft cutoff at ___________ 2.5

Set Charging mode to ________.....  I left mine at Maximum puffs

As soon as you can though, run the Battery Analyzer or take it to someone you know who can do it for you. But use this to at least get you going until you can run the analyzer.

When you take into consideration that the lgs of 3000mAh show on the provided chart above of  28.72wh. I suppose the best answer for everyone and for a beginning start for your particular set of batteries, would be to use 9.6v and not the 11.1 default to figure your wh with the ESribe software. That will get you into the ball park, until you can run a test. Cut off voltage I suppose for a good start would be 2.5v

Okay just finished running the battery Analyzer on my vtc 5s.
 

[Jaquith]

My testing method and settings are correct. The voltage is the Nominal and the cutoff is to spec. The difference, shortage, is due to two things whichever comes first: Discharge instability or Evolv's 3.0V. You only want to use LiFePO4 (9.9V, Nominal 3.3V) for LiFePO4 batteries exclusively, not LiPo's or Lithium ion 18650's (11.1V-10.8, Nominal 3.6V-3.7V) batteries. The Wh variations is due to testing load, Evolv stability requirements and the fact Evolv cuts off at 3.0V and not the batteries rated cutoff .. in essence the Wh are the USABLE Wh to the Evolv's DNA 200 board. Most high Amp draw 18650's are rated for a Nominal 3.6V (some 3.7V), so 3.6V * 3 = 10.8V not 11.1V. You know this by reading the specs. The Battery Analyzer overwrites ANY Wh numbers you enter for the actual Wh before cutoffs (3.0V min) or instability is observed in its testing process. My LG HG2 Profile is so damn good that my jaw dropped and without a 'Low' or any warning and it was able to completely discharge accurately to 0% without any hiccups, drop, dips, warnings http://i.imgur.com/tNAnusqh.jpg Now if you put some lightweight drain or some crazy drain you won't have an accurate or usable Profile.

[rask116@hotmail.com<rask1]

You sound offended by something. No one said your method was wrong in any way. I've read every word in this thread as I stated. From everything I've seen from you, you do seem to be a bit too sensitive. But no matter. You can't argue with what the EScibe battery Analyzer does and as such, it is using  9.6v Do the math and you'll see it's close.  mah x volts divided by 1000. 2600mAh x 9.6v = 24,960.  24,960 divided by 1000 = 24.96wh. My reading from my Battery Analyzer test  came in a bit higher @ 25.15wh (maybe my vtc5s are newer is the only reason) while yours came in a bit lower at 24.81wh. Nothing wrong dude so chill. No one is saying you or  yours is wrong man.  My point is , was and remains, that the escribe software seems to use 9.6 volts in it's calculating while running the Battery Analyzer. As such and for those that just got theirs and hasn't had time to run a test, just use 9.6 volts with the software to get your Wh. It'll put em in the ball park. You of course have the right to disagree, but if you do, you best think about things a bit longer.

[robby]

 

After two full days use at 20watts, still loads of vaping left in these 3 brand new Samsung 25Rs in the Wismec. So glad I moved from lipos to 18650 batteries. Even with an improved Turnigy nano tech 1300 3s in the Vapecige VTbox I would have been into my third cycle. Only getting a .2V drop on the three batteries in use so 0.063V ish per cell. Am I right in believing that the voltages displayed are read purely as a voltmeter and not dependant on any other settings in the "MOD" tab as I reset the cell capacity to 2500?

[Jaquith]

rask116@hotmail.com&lt;rask1 said:

You sound offended by something...

The what? Frustrated maybe, offended LOL nah. That '9.6V' idea you have is just purely wrong, and is baseless by supposition. IF I or anyone used a 'flashlight bulb' for their Battery Analyzer tests then the only differences between 'Rated' Wh and 'Observed' Wh would be from battery cutoff, BUT when someone is pulling 10A plus from their batteries and getting constant 'Weak Battery' at the 50% Indicator or some other error then how useful is a Profile. 

My test coil is a 9A @ 40W which represents most TC scenarios, but it sure doesn't represent someone who is 20A and higher at 150W-200W. My and other Profiles will not be accurate and towards the end of the battery life a 10% or perhaps a 20% may certainly give them a 'Weak Battery' or other error. 

The 'Wh' is the USABLE energy from batteries that the Conditions, Limitations, and Stability were calculated in the Battery Analyzer. Above I've stated the Escribe voltage cutoff and other limitations I've observed.

Example, if you used a flashlight bulb 1A @ 10W test may have been >30 Wh (less the 3.0V Evolv vs 2.5V per Spec; shallow voltage drops) and in contrast a 20A plus @ 150W <20 Wh (much larger voltage drops). The 'Best' Battery Profile is using your batteries on your Mod with your typical build. So IF you're a 150W-200W @ 20A scenario and higher then that's what you need to test. Is this making any sense to you? You say say you read what I typed, but that's different than understanding what you're reading.

[Jaquith]

robby said:

After two full days use at 20watts, still loads of vaping left in these 3 brand new Samsung 25Rs in the Wismec. So glad I moved from lipos to 18650 batteries. Even with an improved Turnigy nano tech 1300 3s in the Vapecige VTbox I would have been into my third cycle. Only getting a .2V drop on the three batteries in use so 0.063V ish per cell. Am I right in believing that the voltages displayed are read purely as a voltmeter and not dependant on any other settings in the "MOD" tab as I reset the cell capacity to 2500?

The Voltage Drop is not a constant; example you'll see a higher voltage drop when the batteries are above Nominal Voltage (Peak) and then a considerably smaller voltage drop once the battery settles to its Nominal Voltage. The amount of voltage drop AND Wh is dependent upon he size of the Load (1A, 5A ,10A, 20A). What your graph is showing is the sum of the 3S cells and the cells are still above Nominal Voltage (Peak is 4.2V, Nominal is 3.6V, Cutoff 2.5V). 

[rask116@hotmail.com<rask1]

Jaquith , You are nuts. I offered you the simple math. End of story. The math proves what I stated. I don't give one iota what you used.

You went totally off the deep end. Not surprised after reading more of your lunacy rants. .

 

When I came here I just wanted to get an idea of what to  use until I could run a test. 9.6 volts turned out to be just that thing that would be safe and allow me to vape my new mod until I could run the test. And our tests prove that to be correct. It's what my numbers, your numbers and 6 other pages of numbers comes out to. What you use, be it something for a tc or not! is irrelevant. The board will adjust what it needs for whatever you put on it. This chip isn't a d a m n flashlight with a simple bulb in it. Stop with that lame analogy dude. This is a complex computer board in our devises . It's programed to do a certain bunch of things utilizing it's power source.
Now!
My batteries , won't generally be the same as yours, even if we got the same ones, the same day, from the manufacturers factory itself. HOWEVER! once the battery Analyzer is run, we still won't be far apart despite what way we may have  used to run the test and it can clearly be seen  in each of our vtc5 graphs. . The point of the battery analyzer in the escribe software, is to tell the chip the best possible mAh your batteries have and when to shut things down This is done via  the chipset  using the algorithms that were programed into it  by the designer/maker/ manufacturer. What you use to run the test is completely irrelevant. If you use a .4 ohm setup running it at 100w or run it at 1.5 ohms at 15w or what ever! your numbers will be close, within a few hundredths. Only difference is that with the .4 ohm at 100w you better have a way to keep things cooled down. With the 1.5 at 15 w it's going to take long tiem for the test to run. That's all there is to it! But your particular chip is going to do what it does.

 

DO it man! Sit there for a day and run various tests using different settings (ohm and watt) but with  the same set of batteries and you too will learn that your batteries are only going to give what they have and each reading will be different but not so far apart from one another to mean anything substantial for the need of the DNA chip.. We run the test, so the chip can best utilize what power your batteries will give to the chip.

 

But we can't get a new dna 200 that uses 18650 batteries and use 11.1v in the escribe software to find out what our 3000, 2900,2600, 2500, mAh batteries equates to in wh for the chip . We can and should use 9.6 volts for that, when a person first gets their mod, so they can at least vape on it without blowing up the dna 200 chip before they can run a test.

 

No wonder you're frustrated. You've not grasped even the most simplistic concept of how things work with this software or the chip itself. Yet you come in here to this thread with your disillusioned idea that you know more than any one else. Here's a reality check for you! Your words have proven that that you don't know much of anything. It's why you're frustrated here. You want to be right, but so many of us in this thread have proven you wrong at every turn. Now go play with your dna 200 and get out of here.