Therion DNA75 SS316L Issues

[imfallen_angel]

giz_60 said:

SS can be a finicky critter to work with...can you post a screen shot of your 'Mod' tab in Escribe & one of 'Device Monitor', while firing, with the following boxes checked...Power, Power Set, Temperature, Temperature Set, Cold Ohms & Live Ohms...also, what kind of coils are you using?

OK, I've reset my mod to default, and back to bad TC... so adjusted 316L to 0.0013 (that gives 1.529 @ 800F), it's "Temperature dominant", 45W, 55W preheat at soft (1) and it's working fairly normal again....


I wonder how long this will last.

I've locked my OHM at 0.28 which the Atomizer Analyser confirmed...

Coils are a dual RTA built, wires are simple generic.

The thing is.. on ALL my "cheap" chinese mods, I have absolutely no issues at all, I can flip the tank from one to another mod (Eleaf, SMOK, Joytech) and put in the exact same settings and get the exact same experience (warmth, and TC cut-off, etc,).

[giz_60]

Can you post a screenshot of your 'Mod' tab...the DNA is a lot more accurate whereas the "cheap Chinese mods" are more forgiving & a lot less accurate...

[giz_60]

Are you using contact or  spaced coils?

[imfallen_angel]

giz_60 said:

Can you post a screenshot of your 'Mod' tab...the DNA is a lot more accurate whereas the "cheap Chinese mods" are more forgiving & a lot less accurate...

Here you go...

Well, for less accurate, they are still giving me a much better experience out of the box and do give me a very consistent experience across all of them...

I wanted to see how different a DNA would be, and so far, it's been 3 days of serious headaches and for "more accurate", well.....it's getting ridiculous.

 

[imfallen_angel]

giz_60 said:

Are you using contact or  spaced coils?

Spaced... tested as tested can be, no hot spots or anything.

I've been building for over  a year, as I said, never any issues, just with this mod.

[Wayneo]

Well your mod thermal characteristics are "evolv's" defaults (not set up, or you reset them)
Your batteries probably some old ones and heating up under load (50F in the first pic) and is running out of power or hit the soft cell cutoff.
AND you're locking your resistance so the board cannot refine the cold ohm value

My suggestions:

• Buy new batteries from the Mooch approved list
• Run your own 'mod resistance' - 5 minutes
• Run your own 'thermal characteristics' - 3 hours
• Download 316L profile from Steam Engine, or use the evolv default or Djlsb value of .00092
• DO NOT LOCK OHMS if your resistance is solid. If they're jumpy, fix your build.

Resistance lock: The DNA 75 relies on the cold resistance of the atomizer to measure temperature accurately. If the connection is not stable or if you find the measured resistance drifts with time, it may be desirable to lock the atomizer resistance 

[imfallen_angel]

Wayneo said:

Well your mod thermal characteristics are "evolv's" defaults (not set up, or you reset them)
Your batteries probably some old ones and heating up under load (50F in the first pic) and is running out of power or hit the soft cell cutoff.
AND you're locking your resistance so the board cannot refine the cold ohm value

My suggestions:

• Buy new batteries from the Mooch approved list
• Run your own 'mod resistance' - 5 minutes
• Run your own 'thermal characteristics' - 3 hours
• Download 316L profile from Steam Engine, or use the evolv default or Djlsb value of .00092
• DO NOT LOCK OHMS if your resistance is solid. If they're jumpy, fix your build.

Resistance lock: The DNA 75 relies on the cold resistance of the atomizer to measure temperature accurately. If the connection is not stable or if you find the measured resistance drifts with time, it may be desirable to lock the atomizer resistance 

hmm...

Well, the batteries are new, married, HG-02s
I did the mod resistance test, which is part of why I locked it, due to from what I've read a few places, should help stabilize things.
I already tried the Steam engine profile, the default and the 0.00092 value with absolutely no success. 

Where I run the same tank/build on a chinese mod at 340F, on the Therion I have to be over 500F... that's way too much a difference to be "not as accurate" here.


The resistance is stable but appears that when the warm up the mod (in the three profiles above) develops some sort of issue.

Not sure where you see the batteries getting hot/under load.

But one thing I can say is that after just a little while (maybe 1/2 an hour of vaping), my batteries (that I left in the Therion overnight to charge) are already down to about 1/2.

At least right now, it appear to be stable with the settings I have on it... but still this is crazy.

[Wayneo]

@imfallen_angel In your 1st Device Monitor screen, it shows your room temp ~68F, board temp ~117F, that's about 50F difference, probably from the batteries. If you could do another print screen, and put that movable vertical where it shows the most sag, and report to us that value. 

The mod resistance is on your battery tab showing .004 which is a perfectly respectable value if it is correct. Although the Mfgr should set it, and perhaps they did, it doesn't mean it's correct for your individual mod. Quick 5 minutes for you to validate.

"I did the mod resistance test, which is part of why I locked it ..." I think you meant you locked the coil ohms/resistance lock. The last 2 lines of my post were a direct copy/paste from the DNA75 datasheet published by Evolv. I trust their words and have never locked my resistance ever.

"I already tried the Steam engine profile, the default and the 0.00092 value with absolutely no success" So many moving pieces from your posts, I'm attempting to start you from square one with a solid setup. You really do need to run your own 'thermal characteristics' for TC to work accurately. Either you wiped reset them to defaults, or Lost Vape never populated the values. Either way, doing your own, while 3 hours is long, will be the most accurate. I've done it for each of my DNA's.

"Where I run the same tank/build on a chinese mod at 340F, on the Therion I have to be over 500F... that's way too much a difference to be "not as accurate" here." I agree with you.

It is crazy, but not hopeless. Your mod seems fairly new (less than 1000 puffs), and probably still within Lost Vapes 6 month warranty, but I think it's too early to call it a faulty mod.

So ..... do you wanna get it done right, or you happy with "At least right now, it appear to be stable with the settings I have on it" 


Edit: "But one thing I can say is that after just a little while (maybe 1/2 an hour of vaping), my batteries (that I left in the Therion overnight to charge) are already down to about Â½." And you're sure these are new Authentic LG's? I vape at double your wattage on the same batteries for much longer on all my mods.

[imfallen_angel]

[QUOTE=Wayneo]@imfallen_angel In your 1st Device Monitor screen, it shows your room temp ~68F, board temp ~117F, that's about 50F difference, probably from the batteries. If you could do another print screen, and put that movable vertical where it shows the most sag, and report to us that value.
[/QUOTE]

This isn't clear.. which sag are you talking about.. aka what value do you mean?

Please remember that this is my first DNA device and I'm a novice to it.

The temp. room are about 73F and board goes to 115 (approx.) when triggered.  When in standby, the board is still at 96 (maybe due to charging).  Tested with and without the battery cover and no difference, even if I kept the batteries as cool as possible.

[QUOTE]
The mod resistance is on your battery tab showing .004 which is a perfectly respectable value if it is correct. Although the Mfgr should set it, and perhaps they did, it doesn't mean it's correct for your individual mod. Quick 5 minutes for you to validate.
[/QUOTE]

Lost Vape shipped this mod with absolutely no settings that I can see, just the profiles for which the SS (and SSL) appears off. I've looked up at values that some people have stated to be average for this mod (as I do not have a brass pin to test myself).  I've looked around and decided to go with 0.005 as this appears the most average figure I could find being reported.


[QUOTE]"I did the mod resistance test, which is part of why I locked it ..." I think you meant you locked the coil ohms/resistance lock. The last 2 lines of my post were a direct copy/paste from the DNA75 datasheet published by Evolv. I trust their words and have never locked my resistance ever.
[/QUOTE]

After reading a LOT of forum threads about this mod, it was recurring that locking the resistance can assist greatly with this mod.

But I've tried both (locked and unlocked) and at this time (as I'm doing these tests best I can) it doesn't appear to make a difference either way.

[QUOTE]"I already tried the Steam engine profile, the default and the 0.00092 value with absolutely no success" So many moving pieces from your posts, I'm attempting to start you from square one with a solid setup. You really do need to run your own 'thermal characteristics' for TC to work accurately. Either you wiped reset them to defaults, or Lost Vape never populated the values. Either way, doing your own, while 3 hours is long, will be the most accurate. I've done it for each of my DNA's.
[/QUOTE]

I've tried all three setups (profiles approach), rebuilding the profiles after doing a "Restore Defaults."

Sadly, Lost Vape's site doesn't even mention the DNA 75 anywhere, so I guess they've stopped supporting it or it's make to use the Evolve basic profiles.

3 hours for what exactly?

[QUOTE]"Where I run the same tank/build on a chinese mod at 340F, on the Therion I have to be over 500F... that's way too much a difference to be "not as accurate" here." I agree with you.

It is crazy, but not hopeless. Your mod seems fairly new (less than 1000 puffs), and probably still within Lost Vapes 6 month warranty, but I think it's too early to call it a faulty mod.
[/QUOTE]

Well, I can modify and get things to work in a fairly "normal" way with the adjustments I've made, maybe it's "normal" for a DNA, but I find it crazy different from all my other mods.

[QUOTE]So ..... do you wanna get it done right, or you happy with "At least right now, it appear to be stable with the settings I have on it"
[/QUOTE]

Well, unless something ends up being definitive, "stable" might be all I can do and may be the "right" way, if it works and keeps working like what I believe it should be like....



[QUOTE]Edit: "But one thing I can say is that after just a little while (maybe 1/2 an hour of vaping), my batteries (that I left in the Therion overnight to charge) are already down to about Â½." And you're sure these are new Authentic LG's? I vape at double your wattage on the same batteries for much longer on all my mods.

[/QUOTE]

Yes, absolutely certain... and while the screen showed about halfway, it stayed there for the whole evening as I used the mod to test it out.

It actually stayed fairly stable with the settings I've put on it, but I'm far from finding it better than my other mods as far as my vaping experience goes.

So for me, it's been working ok-ish today after the headaches earlier, but I have to wonder if this time it'll hold.

[Wayneo]

imfallen_angel said:

This isn't clear.. which sag are you talking about.. aka what value do you mean?

Your battery voltage - black line shows that 'dip' while firing. Value at the lowest point

imfallen_angel said:

Lost Vape shipped this mod with absolutely no settings that I can see, just the profiles for which the SS (and SSL) appears off. I've looked up at values that some people have stated to be average for this mod (as I do not have a brass pin to test myself). I've looked around and decided to go with 0.005 as this appears the most average figure I could find being reported.

Yes, sexy mods with many devices not setup properly by Lost Vape, and numerous complaints of their SS curve. For your mod resistance a conservative value (lower) is better than higher.

Here's a link for a quick and dirty method.  https://evolvapor.forumchitchat.com/post?id=7522239&trail=75

Read from post 72 onwards. OR, here's the short version.

Mod resistance calibration (giz method)

1. A coil will work, but the Test is best run with about a 4in. - 6in. piece of tc wire across an RDA build decks posts. 
2. In Escribe (mod tab), set Mod Resistance to 0. 
3. In wire profile, Power = 1 Temp = 0 / Preheat temp = 1 preheat Punch = 1 Preheat Time Limit = 0. 
4. Upload To Device...attach deck with coil or wire to mod...pulse (quick) fire to get mod to check cold ohms (if new coil question asked, answer yes)...
5. Run Atomizer Analyzer ... allow wire to cool back to room temperature (extremely important) & subtract the Cold Ohms from the Raw Ohms... 
6. The difference will be the Mod Resistance..

imfallen_angel said:

3 hours for what exactly?

Run your own 'thermal characteristics' - 3 hours Same tab (mod) as your battery info lower down. Your 2nd Printscreen, heading "Thermal" Beforehand, watch this video.

https://forum.evolvapor.com/topic/65895-topic/?do=findComment&comment=892012