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DNA 250c - Check Atomizer error on Replay profile

Cloud Anthem

By Cloud Anthem
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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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Posted (edited)

Hey folks,

I'm trying to troubleshoot a rather strange situation I'm getting within Replay mode and the default SS316 profile installed on my Lost Vape Thelema 250c.
When running firing in Titanium or Wattage mode, the mod fires as normal with a pleasant vape. The same can also be said within the Replay profile itself.

Mod: Lost Vape Thelema 250c
Service Pack: 1.1 SP45 INT
Atomizer: Vandy Vape Pyro V2
Ohms: 0.33Ω
Coil Material: SS316 Clapton (24ga + 32ga)
Build: Dual coil (also tried a spaced build as well)
 
However, hitting the 'save puff' button, is where the fun really begins.
I am prompted with a check atomizer warning at the top of my screen while the bright green 'Playing' text is displayed on my screen. When I cancel out of saving the puff, the vape returns to normal.
Can't seem to recall if I had this issue on replay with kanthal builds and sadly don't have any wire laying around to test it again.
I figure okay, its a weird hiccup, so I move on to the SS316 profile and start fiddling around with my settings as shared below.
 
Power: 75w
Temp: 232c
Preheat: 90w
Punch: 5

Now I'm prompted with a temperature protected error despite being able to move back to Wattage or Replay mode and being able to fire the vape as normal.
I decide to migrate my settings over to the other profiles such as Nickel and Titanium both of which are set for temperature control by default. Oddly enough these settings function as normal in both instances.

From here, I figure okay there might be something really wrong with my build so I start doing some checks in the Atomizer Analyzer. Though I do see changes in the ohm reading after a 180 degrees rotation, I'd argue the change in ohm reading is negligible at best.

Am I doing something wrong here, or are there any settings I can fiddle around with to get the most of out my 250c, given Replay is pretty much the selling point of this chip?

image.png.0c8f58d26207b69d5348de4270831cb5.pngimage.png.adeea3dace9c22d8fd4563409f6f72d9.png

Edited by Cloud Anthem
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CMK Senior Member

CMK

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Hi, fangen wir mal ganz von vorne an - was für ein Theme benutzt Du, weil ich lese nun innerhalb weniger Tage erneut, dass die Replay-Funktion in Kombination mit der Auswahl eines Temp-Sensing-Material verwendet wird. 

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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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27 minutes ago, gwyar said:

Hi, fangen wir mal ganz von vorne an - was für ein Theme benutzt Du, weil ich lese nun innerhalb weniger Tage erneut, dass die Replay-Funktion in Kombination mit der Auswahl eines Temp-Sensing-Material verwendet wird. 

I have my own theme but I have also tried the default Evolv theme as well.

I was also able to get my hands on Version 2.0 SP27 of Escribe which allowed me to get SP45 (initially SP38 when I got the error).
Additionally, I've also swapped Replay between Wattage and SS316 profile with the same 'check atomizer' outcome.

Edited by Cloud Anthem
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CMK Senior Member

CMK

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Posted

Meines Erachtens solltest Du den Akkuträger auf Werkseinstellungen zurücksetzen und dann mit dem Stock-Theme auf Fehlersuche gehen. In dem Moment, wo mit eigenen Themes der Betrieb von Replay mit Temp-Sensing-Material ermöglicht wird, kommt es leicht zu Fehlern, weil wichtige Einstellungen, Bedingungen vom Autor des Themes oftmals falsch verstanden werden. 

Weiterhin ist der Betrieb von Claptoncoils, sowie Dual-Coils im TC-Bereich unzuverlässig. Hier sehe ich die Problematik mit der Temp-Protect-Fehlermeldung. 

Für die Check-Atomizer-Meldung habe ich im Moment keine Erklärung - vielleicht den 510er-Pin vom Atty eine Viertelumdrehung herausdrehen für besseren Kontakt? 

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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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5 minutes ago, gwyar said:

Meines Erachtens solltest Du den Akkuträger auf Werkseinstellungen zurücksetzen und dann mit dem Stock-Theme auf Fehlersuche gehen. In dem Moment, wo mit eigenen Themes der Betrieb von Replay mit Temp-Sensing-Material ermöglicht wird, kommt es leicht zu Fehlern, weil wichtige Einstellungen, Bedingungen vom Autor des Themes oftmals falsch verstanden werden. 

So I tried the factory default setting, interestingly enough when vaping in SS316 profile, it will not display the temperature protect message if the wattage is set below 40w (which is not enough to heat 0.3 ohm coils). 
This happens regardless of what temperature is set from 400 to 480f.

With Replay, same situation regardless if atomizer is tightly screwed or a little loose.

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CMK Senior Member

CMK

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vor 16 Minuten schrieb Cloud Anthem:

So I tried the factory default setting, interestingly enough when vaping in SS316 profile, it will not display the temperature protect message if the wattage is set below 40w (which is not enough to heat 0.3 ohm coils). 

Ich dampfe meine 0,37 Ohm Coil bei 17,5W... Entscheidend ist hier neben dem Widerstand die Masse der Coil. So habe jetzt gerade eine 0,78 Ohm Coil bei 32W am Start. 

 

vor 16 Minuten schrieb Cloud Anthem:

This happens regardless of what temperature is set from 400 to 480f.

Die Temperaturberechnung des Chipsatzes beruht auf der hinterlegten Widerstandskurve des gewählten Materials. Bei Non-spaced-coils, speziellen Drähten (Clapton und ähnliche), sowie Dual-Coils brauchst Du schon sehr viel Glück, damit die errechneten Werte mit der Realität übereinstimmen. Daher hat Evolv den Replay-Modus entwickelt und deshalb hat Evolv diesen Modus auch nur für die Materialauswahl "Watt" vorgesehen, da dort der Temperaturschutz ausser Funktion ist. 

Edited by gwyar
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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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2 minutes ago, gwyar said:

Ich dampfe meine 0,37 Ohm Coil bei 17,5W... Entscheidend ist hier neben dem Widerstand die Masse der Coil. 

Size of the wire is specified in the original post but I'll upload a photo just for scale as well. They are 3mm diameter coils

 

3 minutes ago, gwyar said:

Die Temperaturberechnung des Chipsatzes beruht auf der hinterlegten Widerstandskurve des gewählten Materials. Bei Non-spaced-coils, speziellen Drähten (Clapton und ähnliche), sowie Dual-Coils brauchst Du schon sehr viel Glück, damit die errechneten Werte mit der Realität übereinstimmen. Daher hat Evolv den Replay-Modus entwickelt und deshalb hat Evolv diesen Modus auch nur für die Materialauswahl "Watt" vorgesehen, da dort der Temperaturschutz ausser Funktion ist. 

I tried spaced coils and downloaded other curves from www.germandnacrew.de and still faced the same issue sadly. 
 

I think I will move on to Nickel or just stick to Kanthal vaping.

photo6199565626129886129.jpg

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CMK Senior Member

CMK

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Zu der grundsätzlichen Eignung einer coil zum Betrieb als Temp-Sensing-Material gibt es im Chipsatz eine interne Messung - diese ist jedoch nicht mit dem Stock-Theme nicht auslesbar. Die wenigsten Theme-Autoren implementieren diese; in meinem Themes wird die Eignung ("TSM-detect") im Profil-Screen nach einem Puff (und vorhergehender Materialauswahl) angezeigt. Wenn dort im Anzeigefeld ein rotes "x" steht, kannst Du alles rund um TC vergessen - Umschalten auf Material "Watt" und mit Replay glücklich werden. 

Edited by gwyar
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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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49 minutes ago, gwyar said:

Dem Foto nach hast Du (auch) ein Problem mit der Coil selbst - sie sollte nach dem Ausglühen gleichmäßig gefärbt sein. 

 

That was during build phase where hotspots will always happen. Picture is just there to show you the size of the coils. 

 

43 minutes ago, gwyar said:

Zu der grundsätzlichen Eignung einer coil zum Betrieb als Temp-Sensing-Material gibt es im Chipsatz eine interne Messung - diese ist jedoch nicht mit dem Stock-Theme nicht auslesbar. Die wenigsten Theme-Autoren implementieren diese; in meinem Themes wird die Eignung ("TSM-detect") im Profil-Screen nach einem Puff (und vorhergehender Materialauswahl) angezeigt. Wenn dort im Anzeigefeld ein rotes "x" steht, kannst Du alles rund um TC vergessen - Umschalten auf Material "Watt" und mit Replay glücklich werden. 

Very complicated but guess only wattage mode is available if I can't even use replay hah.

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Wayneo Senior Member

Wayneo

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3 hours ago, Cloud Anthem said:

Am I doing something wrong here, or are there any settings I can fiddle around with to get the most of out my 250c, given Replay is pretty much the selling point of this chip?

Is this your first DNA Color Mod? 

1 hour ago, Cloud Anthem said:

I was also able to get my hands on Version 2.0 SP27 of Escribe which allowed me to get SP45 (initially SP38 when I got the error).

What do you mean? It is available right here, the Evolv official site.

1 hour ago, Cloud Anthem said:

I think I will move on to Nickel or just stick to Kanthal vaping.

You mean actual Nickel wire, or Kanthal wire. Earlier you mentioned Titanium. OR are you saying you're using this SS coil with profiles where those materials are selected.

Sorry, those 3 questions are just me trying to wrap my head around this strange situation

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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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1 minute ago, Wayneo said:

Is this your first DNA Color Mod? 

It is indeed. I use the same wire in my DNA60 Billetbox (single coil much smaller build) but no issues on TC.

2 minutes ago, Wayneo said:

What do you mean? It is available right here, the Evolv official site.

my initial download didn't make SP45 available to me when I tried to update service packs. I just included the version to list down as much detail and cover all the bases.

2 minutes ago, Wayneo said:

You mean actual Nickel wire, or Kanthal wire. Earlier you mentioned Titanium. OR are you saying you're using this SS coil with profiles where those materials are selected.

Sorry, those 3 questions are just me trying to wrap my head around this strange situation

no the wire is SS316. I indicated that I can vape using the TC profiles meant for Titanium & Nickel alongside Wattage/Kanthal Mode.
Issues arise when I either head into Replay or SS316 profiles.

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Wayneo Senior Member

Wayneo

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Gotcha 👍

3 minutes ago, Cloud Anthem said:

It is indeed. I use the same wire in my DNA60 Billetbox (single coil much smaller build) but no issues on TC.

I'd suggest you start with this same wire (material) as a single coil in an RDA or RTA on your Thelema.

Then we/you can test in 2 different ways.

SS316 for TC only NO REPLAY

REPLAY mode with 'watts' selected as the material ONLY.

If you're up to that I'll give more specific instructions before you begin. 😀

17 minutes ago, Cloud Anthem said:

no the wire is SS316. I indicated that I can vape using the TC profiles meant for Titanium & Nickel alongside Wattage / Kanthal Mode.

You really ought to watch a video or two on TC as well as Replay. These color boards are different in many ways to your dna60. 

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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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6 minutes ago, Wayneo said:

I'd suggest you start with this same wire (material) as a single coil in an RDA or RTA on your Thelema.

I slapped on my boro tank (0.62Ω @ 30w) on the Thelema and functions across SS316 (TC), Replay TC (SS316) & Replay (Watts).
Though this is in line with my earlier finding, that SS316 seems to function as intended if the power is set below 40w

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Wayneo Senior Member

Wayneo

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Nope, not gonna go there. I need clear answers to clear questions. Your answer is confused.

If that Yup! is in response to that one question I asked "So above 40W on your boro you get 'check atomizer'?"

Then "Boro build passed with flying colors on both TC SS316 and Replay (SS316 setting)." makes no sense.

Which is it?

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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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1 minute ago, Wayneo said:

Nope, not gonna go there. I need clear answers to clear questions. Your answer is confused.

If that Yup! is in response to that one question I asked "So above 40W on your boro you get 'check atomizer'?"

Then "Boro build passed with flying colors on both TC SS316 and Replay (SS316 setting)." makes no sense.

Which is it?

Passed with flying colours as in, it operates as intended without any warning/error messages even going past 56w. don't want to push it further than that else I'll have to re-wick that and billet boxes do take time to put back together.

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Wayneo Senior Member

Wayneo

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Thank you. 👍

This leads me back to the beginning, your 'check atomizer' error, which means just that.

Check there are no loose or stray wires around the deck, the coils can't touch (each other or the cap) while firing, your coil is secured well, and the bottom positive pin is secure.

After you've done that, put it back on your mod and measure the ohms in your SS316 profile, before trying TC only, no replay. EDIT: I hope you have that ability in your theme, OR you can do it in escribe and as always 'upload settings to mod'.

Hope that helps. Let me know. 

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Cloud Anthem Member

Cloud Anthem

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23 minutes ago, Wayneo said:

Thank you. 👍

This leads me back to the beginning, your 'check atomizer' error, which means just that.

Check there are no loose or stray wires around the deck, the coils can't touch (each other or the cap) while firing, your coil is secured well, and the bottom positive pin is secure.

After you've done that, put it back on your mod and measure the ohms in your SS316 profile, before trying TC only, no replay. EDIT: I hope you have that ability in your theme, OR you can do it in escribe and as always 'upload settings to mod'.

Hope that helps. Let me know. 

But the check atomizer warning would be apparent in any setting regardless though, should that have been the case. That should be a safety feature across the board. I did have some check atomizer warnings in the past when replacing the cap which of course was addressed with the build put on earlier today as seen in the photo I uploaded.

I'll be loosening the 510 now as I've never had to adjust it in the past so its one more form of troubleshooting I'll try out.
Using the default Evolv theme in all tests you've requested thus far. If I can get it working from there, I'll then move on to putting my theme back in.


My only other alternative build would be just plain SS316 wire in dual build just to see if there's anything with the wire itself. Its a pre-made spool that I just snip and coil up.

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