Place to share Battery Test Results.

[TKnapa]

Question for Mike... The link on the spreadsheet for the ZOP 1500 40C battery goes to a ZOP 1500 mAh 20C . On Fasttech the 40C version is much larger than the 71 x 34 x 23 mm listed on the spreadsheet. Other sellers have very different sizes for a ZOP 1500 40C , Banggood.com lists it at 9.5*34*66MM. The test results are very impressive for the two ZOP 1500 batteries you tested so I really want to order the same one. Any advice?.--- A very big thank you to everyone involved in the testing, very valuable resource--- hoping I can contribute with some "graphene" batteries I'm buying for test.

[mikepetro]

TKnapa said:

Question for Mike... The link on the spreadsheet for the ZOP 1500 40C battery goes to a ZOP 1500 mAh 20C . On Fasttech the 40C version is much larger than the 71 x 34 x 23 mm listed on the spreadsheet. Other sellers have very different sizes for a ZOP 1500 40C , Banggood.com lists it at 9.5*34*66MM. The test results are very impressive for the two ZOP 1500 batteries you tested so I really want to order the same one. Any advice?.--- A very big thank you to everyone involved in the testing, very valuable resource--- hoping I can contribute with some "graphene" batteries I'm buying for test.

All I can tell you is that this is the link I ordered "https://www.fasttech.com/p/3864308" what I got was actually labeled 40C. Never tried to test the actual C rating, I was just happy with the battery analyzer results. Measurements on the SS were taken by myself and dont match the website listing. I chalked it up to "they screwed up".

[Daniel M]

Does anyone have any ideas on the best way to convert discharge graphs that sadly I can only get as image files since my analyzer uses a proprietary format for its logs?  I know I can eyeball create the graphs but I would love a more scientific automated process.  I just got my LiPo for my DNA today so I haven't had a chance to produce a discharge graph for it but I have attached to example graphs from a charge log from an 11.1v 2200 mah pack out of my helicopter as an example of the type of output I get from the charger/analyzer.   The discharge graphs are identical format they just go the other direction of course.  Even if I have to do it manually this is going to be killer to be able to get my mod spot on for discharge now that I swapped to a lipo pack finally.   Thanks.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 30, 2017 by Daniel M

[VapingBad]

If you can export them into a single spreadsheet make 2 new columns with "Battery Charge (%)","Cell Voltage (V)" and save those to a csv, here is one for 25R at 25 W

"Battery Charge (%)","Cell Voltage (V)"
0,2.9300000667572
1.97464656829834,3.07999992370605
3.60799622535706,3.16000008583069
7.53291082382202,3.30999994277954
10.5192584991455,3.40000009536743
27.4256477355957,3.54999995231628
43.33251953125,3.64000010490417
66.1994171142578,3.83999991416931
96.0385208129883,4.07000017166138
98.0253524780273,4.1100001335144
100,4.17999982833862

 

[Daniel M]

4 minutes ago, VapingBad said:

If you can export them into a single spreadsheet make 2 new columns with "Battery Charge (%)","Cell Voltage (V)" and save those to a csv, here is one for 25R at 25 W

"Battery Charge (%)","Cell Voltage (V)"
0,2.9300000667572
1.97464656829834,3.07999992370605
3.60799622535706,3.16000008583069
7.53291082382202,3.30999994277954
10.5192584991455,3.40000009536743
27.4256477355957,3.54999995231628
43.33251953125,3.64000010490417
66.1994171142578,3.83999991416931
96.0385208129883,4.07000017166138
98.0253524780273,4.1100001335144
100,4.17999982833862

 

Thanks for the reply. Sadly my analyzer software doesn't export into any plain text file so I did the next best thing and just moved the graph over into photoshop and did all the math the hard way by using pixel x y coordinates. In the end it worked perfectly and I ended up with an amazingly accurate discharge profile for the pack. I posted a thread for it detailing the method of testing with the CSV attached in hopes that would make it easiest for others to find since I was not sure this thread was the appropriate place for the CSV file. 

[shadockan]

 

Li-Ion.

It is best to use authentic batteries.

AWT is not a manufacturer.

He has used batteries from Samsung (30Q) and LG (HG2) in the past, as well as batteries from major manufacturers with less mAh.
However, each battery has a different discharge rate and in series it can even become dangerous if it is not the same.
Genuine Li-Ion 18650/26650 manufacturers are fewer.
Panasonic / Sanyo
LG Chem
Samsung SDI (SDIEM)
Sony Energy
MKNE
BAK
PLB
All other batteries in the market, at best, will have some of the above batteries under their cover.
But if there are two different batteries with the same cover, it's not the best case.


Lipo.
 

After using several batteries, I finally saw that there is a lot of lies ......

The 50 ++++ Cs that are stated by different companies are rather simply as a picture, rather than a performance .....

I have been using Lipo batteries  for another purpose (not vaping) and the company that so far is true in what it claims is SLS.

- Our batteries are capable of up to 40C.
Our batteries with more than 40C, have little better performance and we call them 65C.
But our standard battery performance is 40C

I do not know how to upload discharge data, but  the SLS 1300mAh 40C XTRON battery is capable of 15 Wh at 30W,
 with discharge from 12.6V to 9.27V

This showed me the analysis test I made with DNA200 at 30W.
The resistance value plays no role because the DNA200 is step down.

In a step down circuit, we will get what we ask for, irrespective of the Ohmic value of the resistance.

Companies such as Turnigy, Revolectrix, Bonga, Eflite, Hyperion and others, are building good batteries and have provided very good samples in the market.

But companies with bad behavior, personally I will never buy again ..........

Batteries from Fasttech, Gearbest, DX, Alibaba ..... etc ..., I think it's money lost .....

Edited June 16, 2017 by shadockan

[TKnapa]

I have spent the last few months testing a bunch of LiPo packs, but mostly testing the high drain 18650 and every 20700, 21700, 20650 that I can buy, including the elusive 20700A. I've only missed the Samsung 30T.  Some tests have been using the large heatsink with high quality 1 ohm resistors. I've also done quite a bit of testing with the West Mountain system where I can play around with on/off times (example 5s on/off four times in a row, then a 2 minute off cycle.. kind of like how people vape). 

I'm just getting ready to automate a system that will duplicate my vaping style (on/off, time between puffs, hours per day vaping, etc). It will switch to a second mod with fresh batteries to simulate a battery change out. It will rest during normal non vaping hours, etc. This is a bit of overkill, except that I can/will use the system as a final QA/QC procedure post manufacturing, and I'm using it to select the best batteries for a specific device.

Since I'm designing a mod, I've also been measuring cell temperature inside my mod at different ambient temperatures. Also I've tested using different battery contacts.  What I've found in all my testing is that the number I keep coming back to its how many pulses (puffs) before the batteries cannot maintain setpoint (say 100 watts) for 5 seconds.  My test results using Escribe battery analyzer do not match the testing done by Mooch.  Two possible reasons 1) his cells are not contained in a box with other heat generating components, 2) the on/off times are different (10/20 vs 5/30).

Is there any interest in sharing  battery analyzer  information for Li-ion cells,, similar to the LiPo database? Along with the battery info I think you would find that different devices perform differently, likely due to quality of battery contacts (which vary widely when compared to LiPo packs) plus internal heating /dissipation. So if we get four users posting data for Sony VCT5A's but they have different mods, that could be meaningful device information. With all of the new 20 & 21mm cells coming out a lot of people will be making mod decisions and battery decisions. Data gathered through Escribe, in my opinion will be the best source.

[Daniel M]

I think it would be a very valuable database to have. All valid data is good data. The fact that your testing varies from the result from sources like Mooch doesn’t surprise me in the least. My data always does too. His tests often do not at all mirror the usage patterns of vaping.  

 

Also if could just be my tin foil hat side showing but I’d give a lot more weight to testing results coming from users using a known testing method like eScribe’s battery analysis than the data from “high profile” sources.  When all the testing comes from a single person and they become high profile it’s always going to introduce the possibility that they could have a vested interest in changing the methodology to create a specific outcome. But a database of user generated test results with a set method that accurately mirrors the normal duty cycle would eliminate anyone from having an interest in skewing the results. If everyone uses the same method and simply shares results whatever they may be it can create a sample size that’s much larger and give you the ability to filter out any results that might be intentionally skewed as they would be easy to spot as being outside the normal standard deviation between cells. 

As a fellow mod manufacturer gearing up for a mod launch as well I also wish you the best of luck with yours as well. 

[mikepetro]

4 hours ago, TKnapa said:

I have spent the last few months testing a bunch of LiPo packs, but mostly testing the high drain 18650 and every 20700, 21700, 20650 that I can buy, including the elusive 20700A. I've only missed the Samsung 30T.  Some tests have been using the large heatsink with high quality 1 ohm resistors. I've also done quite a bit of testing with the West Mountain system where I can play around with on/off times (example 5s on/off four times in a row, then a 2 minute off cycle.. kind of like how people vape). 

I'm just getting ready to automate a system that will duplicate my vaping style (on/off, time between puffs, hours per day vaping, etc). It will switch to a second mod with fresh batteries to simulate a battery change out. It will rest during normal non vaping hours, etc. This is a bit of overkill, except that I can/will use the system as a final QA/QC procedure post manufacturing, and I'm using it to select the best batteries for a specific device.

Since I'm designing a mod, I've also been measuring cell temperature inside my mod at different ambient temperatures. Also I've tested using different battery contacts.  What I've found in all my testing is that the number I keep coming back to its how many pulses (puffs) before the batteries cannot maintain setpoint (say 100 watts) for 5 seconds.  My test results using Escribe battery analyzer do not match the testing done by Mooch.  Two possible reasons 1) his cells are not contained in a box with other heat generating components, 2) the on/off times are different (10/20 vs 5/30).

Is there any interest in sharing  battery analyzer  information for Li-ion cells,, similar to the LiPo database? Along with the battery info I think you would find that different devices perform differently, likely due to quality of battery contacts (which vary widely when compared to LiPo packs) plus internal heating /dissipation. So if we get four users posting data for Sony VCT5A's but they have different mods, that could be meaningful device information. With all of the new 20 & 21mm cells coming out a lot of people will be making mod decisions and battery decisions. Data gathered through Escribe, in my opinion will be the best source.

Tell me what values you want tracked, I can add a "Cylindrical Cell" page to the Lipo database

[shadockan]

 

I have not saved the measurement result, but I know the Wh that the SLS 1300 3S 40C showed me.
I saw 14.36Wh with discharge at 50 Watts.

In an electronic circuit (especially in a step down circuit), it does not matter the ohmic value of the resistance, but as you report it, the ohmic value of the measurement was at 0.50 Ohms.

Τhe size of the battery is :
LxBxH 72x34x24mm

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1EAh8CnV9zBUSY1UgOWLCY96Ei5f12Aou08xYtcYGeuE/edit#gid=1364592447

[Mike Petro]

10 hours ago, TKnapa said:

Is there any interest in sharing  battery analyzer  information for Li-ion cells,, similar to the LiPo database? Along with the battery info I think you would find that different devices perform differently, likely due to quality of battery contacts (which vary widely when compared to LiPo packs) plus internal heating /dissipation. So if we get four users posting data for Sony VCT5A's but they have different mods, that could be meaningful device information. With all of the new 20 & 21mm cells coming out a lot of people will be making mod decisions and battery decisions. Data gathered through Escribe, in my opinion will be the best source.

What I am suggesting is for you to give me the parameters for cylindrical batteries that you would like to see? I will make a new page for it.

Something like this maybe?  Any changes you would like to see?

Edited November 6, 2017 by Mike Petro

[Daniel M]

I’m thinking on a list that would give us the most useful data. Probably will be a day or two before I have time to really sit down and put all my suggestions together as I’m up to my ears working on final revisions/strength testing a 3D model so I can start producing them in volume. 

As soon as I get some time to take a break from it I’ll pass along my suggestions. 

[Guy Nicolson]

Samsung 30T 21700 2S  21.277 Wh 

Kanthal loops 0.57 ohm @ 60 Watts 

Samsung 30T 2S.csv